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 Get your flowers out kids...

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DoseOrdo
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Dec 28, 2009 6:54 am

Ryler wrote:
This information has upped my spirits considerably ^^
Alas we do still have the loss of Travis but I suppose that makes way for other aspiring writers, no? Hopefully, these are writers inspired by Travis as well.
I just hope the live action series dosn't run mandos over the same way the cartoon is. As much as I hate what they're doing, I still can't deny the fact that for a cartoon its a remarkably good series.

count on it, I know of at least one who is close with KT, and a name you all will recognize, though Im not sure how far along into the process he is so I dont want to lay it out there. I also know several LFL artist with Mando interest, and that sw:tor will have Mandalorians, so trust that Mandalorians on an official base will still push forward, and we will continue to have content coming up to us as we like.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Dec 28, 2009 1:14 pm

DoseOrdo wrote:
Ryler wrote:
This information has upped my spirits considerably ^^
Alas we do still have the loss of Travis but I suppose that makes way for other aspiring writers, no? Hopefully, these are writers inspired by Travis as well.
I just hope the live action series dosn't run mandos over the same way the cartoon is. As much as I hate what they're doing, I still can't deny the fact that for a cartoon its a remarkably good series.

count on it, I know of at least one who is close with KT, and a name you all will recognize, though Im not sure how far along into the process he is so I dont want to lay it out there. I also know several LFL artist with Mando interest, and that sw:tor will have Mandalorians, so trust that Mandalorians on an official base will still push forward, and we will continue to have content coming up to us as we like.

So far I think they're actually keeping Traviss' contributions, at least to a certain era. In the TOR comic the Mandalorians referred to themselves as the Mando'ade, so the old Republic Mandalorians are safe. Rohlan Dyre in the Kotor comic mentioned in the latest issue that children are sacred to the Mando'ade. So they aren't being affected.

And we have Tor Vizsla, Tor meaning justice. Then we have Tal Merrick in the second season, and Tal means blood in Mando'a. Then it seems they're paying tribute to Hayden Blackman who wrote Open Seasons, as a character in the second season is actually named Pre Vizsla. Methinks this is an indication the changes aren't as dramatic as Karen would have us believe. Plus the info from the Atlas combines the two and makes a great job of it. Let's hope the developers of TCW are going to try and make things fit.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:12 pm

I think the only thing thats in danger is the RC and IC books, most people the mando clones.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:02 pm

Gratulor's body wrote:
DoseOrdo wrote:
Ryler wrote:
This information has upped my spirits considerably ^^
Alas we do still have the loss of Travis but I suppose that makes way for other aspiring writers, no? Hopefully, these are writers inspired by Travis as well.
I just hope the live action series dosn't run mandos over the same way the cartoon is. As much as I hate what they're doing, I still can't deny the fact that for a cartoon its a remarkably good series.

count on it, I know of at least one who is close with KT, and a name you all will recognize, though Im not sure how far along into the process he is so I dont want to lay it out there. I also know several LFL artist with Mando interest, and that sw:tor will have Mandalorians, so trust that Mandalorians on an official base will still push forward, and we will continue to have content coming up to us as we like.

So far I think they're actually keeping Traviss' contributions, at least to a certain era. In the TOR comic the Mandalorians referred to themselves as the Mando'ade, so the old Republic Mandalorians are safe. Rohlan Dyre in the Kotor comic mentioned in the latest issue that children are sacred to the Mando'ade. So they aren't being affected.

And we have Tor Vizsla, Tor meaning justice. Then we have Tal Merrick in the second season, and Tal means blood in Mando'a. Then it seems they're paying tribute to Hayden Blackman who wrote Open Seasons, as a character in the second season is actually named Pre Vizsla. Methinks this is an indication the changes aren't as dramatic as Karen would have us believe. Plus the info from the Atlas combines the two and makes a great job of it. Let's hope the developers of TCW are going to try and make things fit.

Hmmm, very valid and interesting points. Now that I think about it, it seems that KTs work has spread out to other things, and that new stuff seems to still take new facts in. And KT has been known to overreact. XD

Thank you for this insight, I think that you have good points and that besides the RC and IC books, that DoseOrdo mentioned, have been pushed aside, mainstream Mandalorian culture seems to be surviving.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 16, 2010 5:11 am

Well, SW.com has announced that in the next Insider issue they are introducing the Mandalorians that appear in the Clone Wars. I quote: "Mandalorians: Explore key moments in the history of this mysterious warrior race! ". Could it be that this is an indicator that they are sticking to established canon, or is the mysterious label put in because they are pulling a blanket over their culture again? But they are still warriors.

In any case, I'm excited to see what they are doing, if a bit apprehensive. These four Mandies sure look cool though. Exclamation
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:50 am

lol I'm such an idiot. I got all excited about reading SOMETHING Mando-related that I got ready to go to the book store and find a copy of that magazine when I looked at the top of the website page and realized that it isn't to be released until the 26th. >_>
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:17 am

Mesh'la Runi wrote:
lol I'm such an idiot. I got all excited about reading SOMETHING Mando-related that I got ready to go to the book store and find a copy of that magazine when I looked at the top of the website page and realized that it isn't to be released until the 26th. >_>

Haha, I did a similar mistake earlier today. I usually order a few books at a time from Amazon due to the shipping rates, and took a long time putting my books in the basket when I realised this issue isn't out for 2 weeks. We Mando fans... *sigh* tongue
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Thu Jan 21, 2010 7:35 pm

Okay, here’s the deal…

As I posted on The Clone Wars thread earlier, I got my “Insider” on Tuesday (because I’m a geek who gets a subscription…)

There are two key articles related to the Mandalorians in this issue of "Insider." The first one is titled “A Brief History of the Mandalorians.” The second one is “Ready for Battle” and is an interview with Dave Filoni regarding the inclusion of the Mandalorians in Season 2 of The Clone Wars.

Here’s a summary of “A Brief History of the Mandalorians”
The article is written in small blocks of pictures and text related to those pictures. It starts with the original 1980 Joe Johnston sketches from "The Empire Strikes Back" sketchbook, describing how the Mandalorians were supposed to be some kind of super-commando unit.

After that, it spans notable years highlighting media such as comics, books, video games, the TV series, and the movies.

For example, here’s a brief listing of some of the media in the article:
1983 – Marvel Comics “Star Wars,” Issues #68-69
1996 – Tales of the Jedi: The Sith War
June 2003 – KOTOR
October 2004 – Republic Commando Game and Republic Commando Novel Hard Contact is listed
January 2005 – Insider #80’s Article on “The History of the Mandalorians”
October 2009 – (Last entry in the article) Star Wars Legacy comic series, Issue #41

Here’s a summary of “Ready for Battle”
The article is done in the standard question and answer format, and I took a couple excerpts that seem to be good highlights for everyone on this forum. (If anyone else wants to add or expand, feel free!)

Q: Did you get the sense that George was using some of the original concepts he had when he developed Boba Fett for “The Empire Strikes Back?”
A: George conceived the Mandalorians as super-commandos from the beginning. We adapted certain elements, but – working very closely with George – we brought them to the screen the way that he envisaged that civilization.

Q: Did you draw from Expanded Universe sources when you were developing them [Mandalorians – mms] for the show?
A: Not particularly. There were only a few scant things that George and I actually used in “The Clone Wars” series itself. That’s not to say that the other EU stuff is eliminated or gone. I know some people will say, “This isn’t the way I pictured it,” but we’re showing a particular point in their history…We’re just looking at one slice of it at this particular moment.

Q: Given the weight of fan expectations, was it a difficult storyline to get right?
A: It’s a story he [George Lucas – mms] wanted to tell. Do we meet the expectations of “Fandalorians” and the various groups that are immersed in that culture? We’ll have to wait and see.

Hope that helps answer some of the questions from the upcoming “Insider” article on both of these topics!
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Mesh'la Runi
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Thu Jan 21, 2010 8:27 pm

Thanks for the preview MMJ! I was really curious what they were going to put into the articles. All I knew is that there were supposed to be some early pictures of the Fett man. (:
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:25 am

So I'll be blunt here but from the excerpts you've provided Mara, doesn't it seem like Filoni is just riding Lucas stick and not paying any attention to the "Fandalorians".

Or is he already using George as an excuse should his episodes go terribly wrong?

I mean this is what he said:

"we brought them to the screen the way that he envisaged that civilization."

"There were only a few scant things that George and I actually used in “The Clone Wars” series itself."

"It’s a story he [George Lucas – mms] wanted to tell."



Seriously? I thought this was Filoni's show and that he was the director and Lucas was just there to put his stamp on the project No
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:33 pm

Just stating facts, unfortunately, ForestRaptor. I wasn't honestly thrilled with the interview either. I knew that Lucas continues to have a lot of control over the TV series.

So sad I had to be the bearer of bad news it seems, but better to break our hopes ahead of time than build them up only to be smashed next week when the Mandalorian story arc starts. Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:40 am

Quote :
Not particularly. There were only a few scant things that George and I actually used in “The Clone Wars” series itself. That’s not to say that the other EU stuff is eliminated or gone. I know some people will say, “This isn’t the way I pictured it,” but we’re showing a particular point in their history…We’re just looking at one slice of it at this particular moment.

I guess this means that everything is still valid except for everything concerning the Clone Wars. That's good, and that's bad. I felt that the Mandalorians of every era were at a point where they are the most interesting just last year, which means the way they are before next Friday, and I don't think they really needed a complete retcon in the Clone Wars era since we already have a very interesting concept that they could have built upon.

You can tell millions of stories about ancient Rome that are always fresh and interesting, even in a very narrow timeframe while keeping every aspect of their society intact. Why is it that they see the Mandalorians as only good for so many stories until you need to reinvent them? That's something I don't understand. The Jedi, while of course much more important to the whole SW lore, haven't been reinvented at all, just expanded upon.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:24 pm

Upsetting, but then I can't quite recall much that George didn't wedge his way into. I mean at first it didn't look like he'd do much more than nod his head to the Force Unleashed crew, but eventually he had his hands in way deep before the game was released and look at how that turned out. Its like he's killing everything he touches Crying or Very sad
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 23, 2010 3:31 pm

I agree Ryder. Personally, I think he's lost touch with the fanbase. It's like he doesn't get it...you run an entertainment business for the fans, you create what pleases them (while not necessarily giving in to their demands), and there has to be a compromise. But he throws his own spin on stories without recognizing critiques from associates. IE:

"George, do you really think we should add this...'Jar Jar Binks' into the movie? The character seems...ridiculous."

"We have to have something for the kids too!"

And look how ep. 1 turned out. Gee Georgey, you'd think you'd learn from your mistakes...guess not.

Ok, rant over. Move along, move along.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:00 am

If anything, adding Mandalorians to the series is in fact an attempt at making the fan base happy. I dont see why adding content for the genre we love is a bad thing. You guys dont even know the storyline yet and your already saying George ruioned it. If he didnt care about the Mandalorian fan base he wouldnt include them at all.

George adds things to the series in order to expand its apeal, thats simply good business. You may hate ewoks but teddy bears sell. For me Jar Jar was to much, but I get what the attempt was.

as for Filoni and others falling in line for what Lucas says... its Lucas story. Why wouldnt the inventer be in charge of his product? Welcome to the grown up world, your boss is in charge whether you agree with them or not.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:30 am

DoseOrdo wrote:
If anything, adding Mandalorians to the series is in fact an attempt at making the fan base happy. I dont see why adding content for the genre we love is a bad thing. You guys dont even know the storyline yet and your already saying George ruioned it. If he didnt care about the Mandalorian fan base he wouldnt include them at all.

George adds things to the series in order to expand its apeal, thats simply good business. You may hate ewoks but teddy bears sell. For me Jar Jar was to much, but I get what the attempt was.

as for Filoni and others falling in line for what Lucas says... its Lucas story. Why wouldnt the inventer be in charge of his product? Welcome to the grown up world, your boss is in charge whether you agree with them or not.

Just saw this trailer now, and as a Death Watch fan of... 5 years I think.... let me say I am thrilled. Had RPed an ex-Death Watchman for 4 years on SWG and now they are a major part of this series. Very thrilled for that inclusion, though I hate the pacifist Mandalorian ideology. But if properly implemented, they could be alright. Again, if PROPERLY IMPLEMENTED.

Of course it is about money, and I don't blame him. You don't make things for the pleasure of yourself and ruining the fun for everyone else, I am sure Lucas is trying to make things appealing to kids, which the show is meant for. But it doesn't change the fact that adults like you and me do get screwed by some of his ideas, which are naturally predictable - not everything appeals to everyone. I so, so hope that the Mandalorians of this show are just a faction seperate from everyone else. Mandalorians have such a rich history that it would be a shame to just make them pacifists until this moment. But I would ignore some of it anyway, so I don't mind. It's fiction so it doesn't bother me TOO much.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:10 pm

Well the Essential Atlas already confirmed that there are factions. True Mandalorians (Jasters group), New Mandalorians (Satines group), and Death Watch Mandalorian (Vizlas group).

in this episode you see a clash between the Death Watch and the New Mandalorians.

I originally was not a fan of the New Mandalorian concept but really it does not effect my character and just adds depth in hardship to a culture that really lacked much depth before hand.

The only real curiousity will be to see what changes are explained in the episode. The Atlas undid KTs last books (showing Alpha02 as mandalore after clone wars) so the question will be does the atlas get the info from the episode? If so does it explain the extent of the change? I've yet to see anything that cancels out the first few RC books so the clones might not be effected. Im intrested in seeing what the clones response is to the Death Watch, it could make a break the Cuy'val dar training storyline.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Mon Jan 25, 2010 4:25 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 29, 2010 7:45 pm

Yeah. So tonight's episode was pure failure. I give up anymore. I really do.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 29, 2010 8:03 pm

Did anyone else have a glitchy episode? Most of the time it was like watching a DVD skipping. I lost a TON of audio, and the picture skips were so bad I missed about 1/3 of the episode. That probably is a good thing considering what I did catch was just....WTF???

I did ponder couple of questions, though, and I wonder if anyone else has an answer to them:

1. Was the "Concordian" language supposed to be Mando'a, and if it was, did anyone catch if the words they used were really (Traviss') Mando'a?

2. I thought Beskar'gam was supposed to be...superior to weaponry? Visla just knocked off one of his own guys with a blaster bolt. Um....what?

I think I'm just more confused from this episode than anything. I'll stick to the history from Karen Traviss, thanks.

Clone Wars is nothing but a kiddie show, and "The Deserter" is by far still my absolute favorite episode.

Rant over...until next week. Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 29, 2010 8:17 pm

Ms.MaraJade wrote:
A) Did anyone else have a glitchy episode? Most of the time it was like watching a DVD skipping. I lost a TON of audio, and the picture skips were so bad I missed about 1/3 of the episode. That probably is a good thing considering what I did catch was just....WTF???

I did ponder couple of questions, though, and I wonder if anyone else has an answer to them:

1. Was the "Concordian" language supposed to be Mando'a, and if it was, did anyone catch if the words they used were really (Traviss') Mando'a?

2. I thought Beskar'gam was supposed to be...superior to weaponry? Visla just knocked off one of his own guys with a blaster bolt. Um....what?

B) I think I'm just more confused from this episode than anything. I'll stick to the history from Karen Traviss, thanks.

A) Nope. Mine came in clearly. Must've been your cable provider or something. :/

1) I was wondering the same thing. As far as I can tell, it didn't sound anything like Mando'a (MAYBE a few words...if you stretch it...). I think it was just some entirely new made up language tbh. When they mentioned Concordia, I thought they were referring to Concord Dawn, but apparently those are two separate entities, so my mentioning how Arla Fett's language sounding similar to Mando'a but slightly off is irrelevant... lol

2) Better than the blaster bolt was the fact that Obi seemed to know just where to hit twice on the faceplate to "turn off" the Mandos. They fell in useless heaps after like two taps! Goon squad, activate! (And the leader guy [Vizsla? COME ON...] was a total wuss for just sending his cronies in when Obi knocked him back. :/) I love how the one guy got hit with a rock and then was easily taken out... >_>

B) I don't accept the Clone Wars as canon, and I've said this several times before. Traviss' work and most of the other stuff prior to this BS is the only thing I'll ever truly consider to be "Mando."


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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 29, 2010 10:17 pm

To elaborate on the rock incident...

The rock merely distracted him, then Obi-Wan proceded to pwn him with WTF?!-Fu. How? Dunno. It's WTF?!-Fu. It never makes sense.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Fri Jan 29, 2010 11:30 pm

Oh lawrd...

We can at least hope for the redemption that will never come by the end of the three part series? I mean after all they were "bad guys" and thus scripted to die from the very beginning. Maybe if we see some "good guy" mandos they might actually be of some good? However unlikely as this is.

I wont give up all hope till the three-part series is done.
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 30, 2010 6:41 am

Ms.MaraJade wrote:
Did anyone else have a glitchy episode? Most of the time it was like watching a DVD skipping. I lost a TON of audio, and the picture skips were so bad I missed about 1/3 of the episode. That probably is a good thing considering what I did catch was just....WTF???

I did ponder couple of questions, though, and I wonder if anyone else has an answer to them:

1. Was the "Concordian" language supposed to be Mando'a, and if it was, did anyone catch if the words they used were really (Traviss') Mando'a?

2. I thought Beskar'gam was supposed to be...superior to weaponry? Visla just knocked off one of his own guys with a blaster bolt. Um....what?

I think I'm just more confused from this episode than anything. I'll stick to the history from Karen Traviss, thanks.

Clone Wars is nothing but a kiddie show, and "The Deserter" is by far still my absolute favorite episode.

Rant over...until next week. Laughing

1) It is Concordian dielect, as seen in Traviss' books. It's appearently spoken on both Concord Dawn and the Concordian moon. Dave Filoni confirmed this in the Q&A on the SW.com website.

I did some research. The prhase where he leapt to his death: "Calhava bru'chun dralshye'ran", only the last word can be compared. Dralshy'a means stronger and brighter, which is very appropriate for a Death Watchman (LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE). It could mean, and this is pure speculation, something along the lines of "This sacrifice makes me stronger". Or something like that. The two beginning words aren't compareable to Mando'a, but at least they stuck to the rules (no Z, no F). A language that has been seperated for 730 years from it's source gets scrambled. Real world example WARNING: Faroese is a language that has survived in the Faroe Islands between Iceland and Scotland. It can be understood by Icelanders with Danish knowledge, but is so different otherwise in it's pronounciation and grammar most Icelanders don't. And Iceland and Faroe Islands have been seperated for about 700 years.

The Death Watchman's second line is (listened to it over and over on my *******) is "Sesulu se kad se darasuum kot", and the nearest Mando'a equivilent (spelling?) is "Susulur sa kad sa darasuum kot", meaning "Hear as sabre as eternal strength". I think this is supposed to mean something along the lines of "Heard as an eternally strong sabre", as in his terror act will be remembered and revered. Probably a poetic quote.

2. This is Lucas...

Personally, I think I could very well make this fit with Traviss' and other's work in my head. At least some of it, wouldn't want Jango to be considered an aruetii. :p
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Title : Mirsh'kyramud
Number of posts : 144
Planet/System : Fantasy land
Credits : 165
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Registration date : 2009-03-24

PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   Sat Jan 30, 2010 6:51 am

Sorry for double post, but I just remembered one thing.

Does anyone else find it troubling that there is not a single alien species on Mandalore? And to add to it, that all Mandalorians have blue eyes, white skin and light hair? Is this the vision of the 3rd reich come to life? Suspect
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PostSubject: Re: Get your flowers out kids...   

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Get your flowers out kids...
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